I would have to disagree on Lenshu3ng because of the point system being unstable at times or in a better way, random. Sometimes I'm plating someone in Lenshu3ng and out of no-where they get 10k points from the slightest touch. I would say Aikido or most ABD due to the many options a player can take to defeat their opponents or counter their moves. Random stuff happens in every mod but I think when it comes to a pro player fighting an average player, Aikido would be the most consistent at showing who's the better player overall.

the "point system" is the same in every mod (except now wushu_2015, because the creator has changed how many points certain areas get). that being said, it's not random, once you begin to understand which parts are weak and strong you'll understand how to get points and why you lost points.

for example some inexperienced players will say points are random when they kick their shin into another players knee, not knowing that knees do not take damage. or when their wrist gets kicked and it does, as you said 10k damage, not knowing that wrists are pretty week and takes some of the most damage next to the head.


anyway, i'd have to say lenshu3ng is probably the most 'consistent' mod in terms of the better playing winning. it doesn't matter if you can run in the mod, because even when running you have to be pretty skilled at getting around in the gravity, and medium sized ring area. i'd say 9/10 the better player during the match wins: whoever makes the best decisions, whoever knows how to get more points, whoever knows how to move around accurately and efficiently in the area provided. it's a good mod, there's a reason it became my favorite after needing to learn it for the clan league. i don't know of many other mods as good as lenshu3ng in those respects. i don't believe any grab mod could be consistent either, because from the start there is already immediate pressure put on one of the weakest joints (the wrists). because of the way people grab each other with a clap most times (aikido mods), this goes for tk as well.

I dunno about the issue with wrist dms. The counter for any gamemode to reduce the effects of random chance like that would be to make it a bo5 or something like that.

And, technically, wrist dms aren't all that random to begin with. If people both grab and you see points come up from the grab, then the wrist is damaged. Relax it and the odds of it breaking are now significantly lower.

It depends what you mean by "best player". If who is the best player is determined by their win ratio and the difference in win ratio between them and the "other great players" is constant then the only real factors are the amount of uncertainty over who wins which is created of unpredictable and unavoidable events like random wrist fracs or whatever, and the power of certain moves and counters which only someone with the highest win ratio (the "best player") would be able to know and use. The unavoidable glitches in most mods can be made less likely with certain strategies and the inconvenience caused by them can be minimised is a player is careful enough so this factor isn't even invariable for different skill levels within a single mod. Therefore we would need to know more specifically what level they are at if we wanted to be exact, although perhaps so much detail isn't necessary when we look at how much mods differ. Nevertheless it would be nice to see more discussion on what actually makes a player great.

TL;DR version: What do you mean by "the best player".

Disregarding and not reading anyone else's posts I answer ABD because of multiple factors and decent skill level required, plus it usually requires the player to have equal skill level to his opponent to beat him or close if you exclude shovels and other cheap maneuvers etc.

the only thing inconsistent with mods is the dismemberments and fractures so I guess any mod can be made consistent if dismember and fracture is disabled.

I think greykido. I love all aikido based mods, greykido is probably the most chalenging one I think.
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Don't forget about pointthreshold, most mods have this on 0, but if you'd change it the mods still aren't very consistent.

Myself being a TK player on high lvl I can say that TK Isn't a consistent mod. We jokingly call it fuckyou.tbm for the "random" wrist dms and insane point scoring. Aikido based mods are the most consistent (grey/abd most imho), bit more boring and easier than TK imho. But definitely consistent while allowing for reactive counterplay,

TK with much higher dm would be a clusterfuck

A skilled player will win nigh on 10/10 lenshu3ng.tbm games over a less skilled player any day of the week. In my opinion it's the pinnacle of competitive Toribash and instead of trying to convert mods like aikido/wushu etc. that weren't designed with competition in mind we should be looking at making totally new mods that are balanced around competition from the get-go.

Also, the first mistake you make (and many others make) is looking for a competitive mod by judging what duellers do. People who duel (at any level) want to win despite the nature of the competitive viability of the mod. If you're duelling you want to minimise random occurrences and maximise your chances of winning - those two things do not necessarily give you the most balanced competitive mod.

as someone, who probably would be one of the first to start playing toribash competitive, i would agree with most of the people and say taekkyon. but i also would agree with gynx.

yes, taekkyon is great, it has the fast reaction's things, its short (idk actually if thats bad or good) and its fast "paced" means u have to react to things quickly.
but it still is to a certain degree randomness in the game. sure u can relax stuff to lower the chance of getting DM'd, but u cant really see at which point it would break (except some obvious stuff) so im kinda sure that if i were the best player and would play against an average player, that i only end up winning like 8/10 because something unexpected happened that i could not control to that point.
if u look at the currently most competitive games, there is about to exactly no randomness involved (only thing that i get to my mind is Counter strike, where if u'r "lucky" a bullet can spray in such a way that u hit the enemy anyways, even if u did not aim for him, but the chance of the occurence is quite low that it pretty much bother's no one.)

i guess if its about a "perfect" competitive mod we either need some sort of tool that shows us EXACTLY when THIS joint is going to DM/Fracture, or simply play without those feature's which on the other hand would take away like half the game is made about. also a low TF is needed so you have the most possible control of your tori, while also being in need to plan things beforehand, the matches should not be too short (but could be, if DQ is enabled or such, like a fast rush) but also not be way too long, so that if u got set behind in the beginning u still have the chance of a comeback.

so the main thing, about competitive gaming is that u NEED the FULL CONTROL of whatever u are doing. which u cant assure in toribash to a certain point.
i didnt played lenshu in ages, so i cant say anything about that...