A clan and a museum are kinda different. A clan is designed to connect people who (using their connection) can do good things together which they might not have been able to do otherwise. A museums only purpose is for old stuff, bad analogy.

TBH if the activity checks don't already take into account clan hosted events or participation in things like the clan league I can understand people's doubts. Although obviously it is kinda silly to criticise a system I know so little about.

You're missing the point. I'm sure no one here bar very few people think clutter is a valid reason for removing clans at all, much less the clans that they're going to remove. If a clan periodically kicks on and participates in events like RAWR does, why take that away? I feel that clans serve as a reason for inactive players to come back to the game and play more than they serve as a tool for newer players to get organized or whatever.

And besides, if the argument is that you do not want to be biased to clans that have been the backbone of toribash in the past, why would you be biased towards clans that have members of the upper administration in them? Bias is bias, if you say you don't want bias in the process of removing clans, then it's hypocritical to be biased.

As far as the drama goes, both of the examples you mentioned were reasonable measures taken to combat farming and scamming. This seems to combat friendship more than anything else, and is not reasonable as far as I am concerned.

There isn't bias for historical clans either way, that is the point. I'm pretty sure they completely removed bias from the system beyond Official vs. Unofficial clans (harder to keep official because it is more prestigious). I don't think there is any difference in treatment depending on members or clan history. Bias is bias and there isn't any here. And sure drama doesn't make a decision good, but it isn't a reason not to do something, there should be enough reasons to oppose something people obviously feel so strongly against without using the fact that people will make a fuss as a criticism, fuss is kinda inevitable.

Other than that I can really see where you are coming from. But it is important to remember that by having high standards we should end up with a better selection of clans (in terms of current actions rather than historically) eventually.

For all the people wondering why such a no brainer as a legendary clan section being made needs to be discussed I imagine that there is a debate between whether the effort it would take to set that up and decide who judges each clan and how it would be judges would be worth keeping some old-schoolers happy. To be honest I feel like a lot of the selection of newer members who have posted their complaints here might give the exact same complaints if it was a non historic clan being closed (that closure pending thread was pretty sad ) just out of empathy for the members. That being said the job of the forum and ultimately the staff (obviously aside from keeping shit legal with real money scam reports and indecent content and all that jazz) should view making the community happier for longer as their main aim when it does not apply to assuring profitability. The only way I could see economic factors being involved would be that closing clans means that more people have to buy new clans and subsequently sink tc which might lead to more tc being sold but that is a tenuous link at best. Subsequently if the "drama" being experienced is just people being unhappy (and these people are genuinely unhappy rather than just taking part in the communal drama session this has become) then the drama might be something to consider in some situations.

I feel like I have written a lot of bullshit, sorry, it happens sometimes. I swear I do it by accident.

The bias part was the part about spirit/MAD being untouched because of who's in them. There's no way that any of them would have the balls to piss suo/hampa off, although I guess it's fine to piss everyone else off is what I was going for by saying that

It's not a matter of pissing someone off, it's just that the clan could easily be re-added back if hampa were to notice. Plus, spirit hasn't been "untouched", if you were to look.

not got the time to respond to other things, may do so later, however:



notice the lack of spirit

it was decided that the only truly untouchable clan is [MAD] some time ago, having members of administration is no longer something considered for clan activity

My bad, I didn't check beforehand.

I'm kinda surprised. I really should've checked before posting that.

I'm glad there's no bias involved in any case, but i'm still disappointed that it's happening in the first place.

Spirit's already been killed, that happened a while ago. You can note the lack of clan tag on suo's posts.

*EDIT* Damnit hanz0! Let a man write an essay before you ninja him!

The logical clan to point fingers at would be mine since top of the tree = biggest most obvious target; thing is it wouldn't work because it aint immune. Also people forget I exist so yeah

K so I've been observing this, much like I observe everything else & finally decided to speak out on behalf of my slaves... and to maybe clear some stuff up.

I'll kick off explaining the MAD thing. Technically speaking MAD aint a clan, it's got a clan tag and a handful of people, however its purpose isn't as a clan - devs need a means of testing things, and if that involves testing something that requires being in a clan then they're good to go. So yeah, it's best to just ignore it's existence.

Now that's out the way I'll clear up things.

Staff bias on staff clans?

Doesn't exist. As already stated suo's clan got killed, and since they were the 1st CL winners + the reason Demon exits I'm pretty sure they fall into the historical category too. However they died.

"Immune" clans?

That was a thing until not too long ago. It covered clans that have devs & the upper end of the game's staff in them; and also old or as you lot put it "legendary clans".
Then people bitched and moaned. "Why is my clan being killed when [insert previously immune clan] has been inactive for months?" "That's not fair." "That's bias" and so on.
So it was decided that immunity would be dropped for all normal clans (MAD not being classed as normal), including ones with staff in them that were previously immune.
In other words - no one's safe. But I'll come back to this.

Why kill clans if their boards etc aren't being physically killed?

If a clan isn't active enough on the various things they're checked on they get killed after failing multiple times in a row, that we've established. The tag is killed off, members are set free, and in some cases the world ends and everyone cries... *cough*
However that isn't necessarily the end, a killed clan can rebuild itself, and in the process regain it's old board. There's also the "historical" factor so if a clan dies and stays dead the existence of the clan isn't lost, if that makes sense.

Gynx is evil

Gynx answers to me, the removal of clan immunity had to go through me, which in turn has resulted in this. No point shouting at him, it's rude to kill the messenger.

Baaaw RAWR baaaaawwwwww! Urban NOOOOoooo...

If you're in one of the clans affected by this then you can skip this part.
If not then where were you when every other old/historical clan died? I'm not aiming to be a dick when I say that, but I didn't see you fighting for them. If it's took you this long and this many clan deaths to notice then is it something that really affects you? >_>

For those affected in the clans

A clan dying doesn't change who you are, or any impact the clan had in the past - things are remembered. People are remembered.
I'm not going to argue over activity, if a clan has consistently failed then there's clearly issues in that regard - more so in older clans since you don't actively recruit new members and end up with a large roster of inactive people. It's just the way things are.
As stated above, this isn't the end. A clan can be rebuilt if you're willing to "work" for it, and if you're not then you can either carry on without clans or walk into another - I'm pretty sure there's no one who'd turn you down & you've got plenty of friends in other corners of the community.

Other things and words and stuff

I'll happily say that if we hadn't got our shit together, my clan would be on the chopping block right now. Instead of letting it die we're working on keeping it alive because it's our corner of the community that we built.
Hyde stated that Evil had to do the same, it faced death and with a bit of help from others is still alive.

Something something LEGENDARY CLANS

Something is being thought up regarding this, however it will not involve immunity for them - we can't do that now without reviving every dead legendary clan, it just doesn't work that way.
If you scroll through this you'll notice clan league winners have icons, and MAD has a TB logo because devs etc. It's most likely that something will happen akin to that or somewhere else as a memorial to them.
We can't keep things alive just because of history, that way every clan would go stale and after a time end up in the same boat.
/me shrugs
We'll figure something out on that front.

So yeah. It aint all bad, in the case of RAWR if killed they only need 5 people (of which a minimum of 3 must have been in the clan originally) and a handful of TC to make a come back. Apply the same to any other clan. The upside being that they wouldn't have a roster of inactive people contributing towards negative activity checks in the future.

Now that's done I'm going to go pick on Ryan for being Ryan, and I may decide to reply to posts on here later if people aren't playing white knight for the sake of white knight.

So;
1. To free up tags
2. To free up members

Is this really a compelling reason to do all this work? Are tags in such short supply? Is there a queue of people waiting to pick up RAWR or [MAD] or Urban or whatever - and if so, should we really be killing clans to let them take the tags?

Will inactive members really become active again and join new clans? Do they want to? Are active members in existing inactive clans really trapped within their clan waiting to be set free?

Honestly I don't think these are good reasons to purge inactive clans. At the very very most it might justify flagging them as inactive (which still seems pretty pointless since you can always tell if a clan is active by how active it is...), but locking and archiving their forum and removing their tag is completely pointless... It isn't a small amount of work that's being done, if there's no good reason to actually do all this work and piss all these people off, then it probably doesn't need to be done.

People keep overlooking the obvious advantage of requiring clans to be active to avoid being murdered by Gynx the Butcher. It results in clans being more active on average. I know it isn't a substantial gain and not many people really care about whether other clans are active very much but that doesn't mean you can completely overlook it as a benefit. And if people are willing to work for free to do this stuff then that's their choice, they get to feel important to the maintenance of the forum and having something to do as payoff.